[00:00:30] Hey everyone, Sam Ovens here and today I have Jesse Navarro on with us. Jesse has an awesome story, he got started with Consulting Accelerator about 2015 or 2016, somewhere around then. Back then when he joined he has his own financial planning practice and he was making around 10 grand a month, 120 grand a year. He joined Consulting Accelerator, went through the program and now he's helping entrepreneurs start their own course and promote their own course, which I'm interested to see how that evolution and transition happened. Now you're making about what, 220 grand a year, about 20 grand a month selling that and still financial practice is about the same or has it grown a bit?
[00:01:00] Yep. Financial practice is about the same, I went through some lulls with the financial practice but in fact, I'll share that with you a little later, there's one piece in the consulting course that I actually leveraged to help my financial practice. I can share that later.
Sam Ovens: Cool. Let's talk about when you joined Accelerator in 15, 16 what was going on?
[00:02:00] I remember the exact moment I was watching the webinar, I was helping my sister-in-law move into her new apartment and I've always wanted to start a business. In fact I started my first domain in September 27, 2009. Failed. Setting up something to build a business online and haven't started again until I think it was like, 2015, 2014. I saw your webinar and it was such a compelling offer I figured I'd give it a try. That's kind of where I was at, I knew I wanted to start a business but I wasn't sure what business, what it wanted to be. I do financial planning consulting already so I figured I could probably do consulting in some other area.
Sam Ovens: Got it. How did you discover the program?
[00:02:30] I got an email from Ty Lopez, in fact I had been working with Ty since 2014, went to his Masterminds and he actually kind of sparked the interest of me wanting to start another business again. That was funny, that was almost like a prerequisite to starting the consulting program because if I didn't have that prerequisite I would have saw your consulting stuff I probably just would have dismissed it. That's kind of about that.
Sam Ovens: Got it. What interested you in the program?
[00:03:30] It's funny, I think it was more how simple you made it. In your webinar it was pretty interesting because you talked about the major problems that most consultants have. That was my problem. In my business, the max I could really charge people is like 1%. I have a client that is a million bucks, I get $10,000 a year but I don't even collect that full 10,000 because a lot of it goes to the brokerage house. I work really hard for these clients for a very small dollar amount. There's got to be another way. When I saw your thing and how much money consultants can make with the same amount of work I'm doing right now, I was like, wow that's cool. Plus you had a pretty compelling offer back then too. It was stupid for me to not accept it.
Sam Ovens: Got it. Then you joined the program and what happened next?
[00:04:30] This was very interesting because I joined the program, this was back then when you had one of your first online, I think it was [inaudible 00:03:57] or something. I went through it, I went through the entire course and I didn't even know what niche I wanted to do. I was like, how about I just do digital marketing. I started putting together, I went through the entire course in the beginning, going over the paint and everything and the avatar and that didn't work. I was like, well let me do another niche. How about MMA. I don't know why I decided to do MMA, that was very stupid but I decided to do MMA. I did MMA. I did the whole thing, I bought a bunch of books on MMA, same thing. It just didn't work out. Then I had a buddy of mine reach out to me, oh before that I did financial planning. I was like, how about I help other financial planners create their own, help them with their business. I did that, I pushed really hard on that and created a whole course, I did everything on that. In fact I had three paying clients. I just was a huge struggle plus with industry regulations it didn't work out.
[00:05:30] Then I had a buddy of mine I met at Ty's place, he said, "Hey look" Josh [Erp 00:05:05], he said, "Hey look, I'm looking to set up a course, can you help me out with that?" The funny thing about your consulting programs, since I already went through the course probably five or six times by that time, I already know exactly how to put the funnel together, do the copywriting, basically just build the entire thing. I was like, well I'll give it a try. We built it and just immediate success. What happened afterwards was we did the course, we went from zero to six figures in nine months. He had no email list at all. We hit six figures in just nine months, it was crazy. I own half the business and it continued to snowball from there. We started to do more Facebook ads ...
[00:07:00] Point, I think, we can compare. I think I was if not outperforming, very closing to Consulting.com, Sam Ovens. I know you're a competitive guy, we could show. You're obviously beating my numbers right now but this was in 2016. If I did beat it, it's probably for two weeks. That's my claim to fame if that ever did happen. From there we just kind of took it out even further. I was like, what affiliates can we work with? We got Ty Lopez, we got my buddy Josh [Erp 00:06:31] on the Ty Lopez SMMA program. Things started to go wild from there. You know Chris Records. We had Josh [Erp 00:06:39] part of Chris Records group with techademics and that grew bigger from there. The guy's name is Dick [Striseuss 00:06:47], we got him on board with Dick [Striseuss 00:06:49] 4% group. It just kept growing. We got invited to Brian Tracy show. It was just crazy how successful this thing got. That's kind of just the beginning of it. Then I kind of went out further, I was like, "What other entrepreneurs can I help out with this?"
[00:07:30] I reached out to Sean Bossler, you know Sean. Sean Bossler I said, "Hey look, I know you're building a course, can I do something similar to kind of what I did with my buddy Josh?" He said, "Sure." I flew down to San Diego, hung out with Sean Bossler and we put some stuff together, created emails for AJ Morrison, in fact I even created emails for the Sam Ovens as well, it's a 70 email campaign. It's pretty wicked man, I've got to show you if you're interested. It's killer.
Sam Ovens: How did you create emails for me?
Jesse Navarro: Through Sean Bossler. It's one of Sean's promotions that he was doing.
Sam Ovens: Oh okay.
[00:08:00] He was like, he was trying to figure out where he needed help with. He was kind of like, "Well I got this promotion with Sam Ovens coming up, can you help me create these emails?" I was like, "Sure." I created a 70 email campaign for you. It's pretty cool. Thing is, I developed a whole structure with hero's journey and copywriting, basically it's a whole method that I created.
Sam Ovens: How did you beat me for these two weeks?
[00:08:30] Through Facebook ads. For just two weeks, I think it was in 2016, I could pull up the numbers here but in two weeks in 2016, it was, one day it was crazy we had like 37 sales in one day and we only spent I think $100 in ad spend. I think it was a $30,000 day. Now I don't know 100% but I mean it's pretty hard for someone to beat it. Maybe you're beating it now. That's what I said, you're 100% beating me now but one part in 2016 it was doing pretty well.
We don't get 30 grand back from $100 in spend. That doesn't happen ever.
Jesse Navarro: Well, it did one time. In fact, it could have been because we were sending out email promotions too and everything. I mean, anyway.
Sam Ovens: The trick is to make it happen for more than one day.
[00:09:30] Well, yeah. See, the one mistake that I made was, I'm okay with Facebook ads but the scaling part, in fact I joined Uplevel to learn how to scale. I still never figured the thing out. You talked about being a full stack guy, for the most part I can do copy, click funnels, ads, I mean I can throw it all in an active campaign. I can do everything except when it comes to scaling ads. For some crazy reason I can't do that. That's the one mistake, well there's many mistakes but if there's one biggest mistake I made that probably cost me a million bucks was not hiring someone to help me scale ads. Had I done that-
Sam Ovens: The thing about scale is time.
Sam Ovens: That's how you get scale. You need to have ads running all day, every day, 24/7, 365 for years. Then you get better. You can't get into that like, "Oh turn this thing off, turn this thing on. Let's do a promo here, oh let's turn it off." If you do that you'll never scale.
[00:10:30] Right. At that time I think our ads were going for, I think, maybe five or six months at that time. It wasn't even close to a year.
Sam Ovens: That's still long.
Jesse Navarro: Yeah.
[00:11:00] We can jump into that a bit later in the interview and discuss why but what I want to know is when you joined the program, Consulting Accelerator, we get you to try and find a niche, to focus on some area of the world, some cluster of people and then what we get you to do is try and find what problems they have and then you can help them solve that problem therefore creating value. How did that pattern play out in what you did?
Jesse Navarro: The biggest problem I find with these entrepreneurs like Josh for example-
Sam Ovens: Let's start with how you're identifying and defining these entrepreneurs because that's very broad. It must be, tell me how you get this idea for these entrepreneurs.
Can you explain the question another way? I don't think I-
Sam Ovens: You said the niche is entrepreneurs.
Jesse Navarro: Yeah. That's a big niche.
Sam Ovens: There's all sorts, there's entrepreneurs who just bought a Subway franchise license. I bet you're not really helping them.
Jesse Navarro: Nope. I am not.
Sam Ovens: Let's get it tighter.
Jesse Navarro: Okay. It would be entrepreneurs who have some sort of digital asset. Is it retail or digital, it's 100% digital asset.
That Subway franchise owner probably has a digital asset, they've probably got a cash register which has some sort of digital in it.
Jesse Navarro: Yeah.
Sam Ovens: Again, it's too loose. What is a digital asset?
[00:12:30] I found that I did very, very well with entrepreneurs who have some sort of following, have some sort of distribution system, distribution channel but they don't really have a product or a strong product to sell to that channel.
Sam Ovens: By product do you mean courses?
Jesse Navarro: Yeah, it could be a course. That's probably the main thing is a course.
Sam Ovens: You don't mean like a razor, a shaving-
Jesse Navarro: No.
Sam Ovens: Okay. See how these words-
Jesse Navarro: Yeah, you're right. I tried eCommerce and I failed miserably at eCommerce. Courses- [crosstalk 00:12:58]
You're really helping course sellers.
Jesse Navarro: Yep.
Sam Ovens: Who already have customers.
Jesse Navarro: Yep.
Sam Ovens: To what? What's their problem? Because distribution and a following, those are loose things but if you say what you really mean is customers. If there's some customers. They're course sellers. Very different from any entrepreneur in the world. You help course sellers with customers, now what's their problem?
I'll give you an example. One problem one of my clients is running into is conversions. He was able to hit 100,000 a month in his business and then Facebook changed the rules where you can't say this one thing and his conversions dropped. What I helped him out with was creating a different angle and a different hook.
Sam Ovens: Why does he care about conversions?
He cares about conversions so he can make more money and he can get more clients in the front door.
Sam Ovens: Why does he want that?
Jesse Navarro: Well, so he can make more money.
Sam Ovens: Why does he want that?
[00:15:00] Well, that's a good question. Well, I know the money goal he wants, he said he wants to make $200,000 a month but why? That's a good question. I never really challenged him as to why he wants to make $200,000 a month. That's the biggest lesson that's part of Sam Ovens that I'm realizing right now that I made a mistake on is challenging him on why $200,000 a month. I don't know. That's a good question. I don't know why he wants $200,000 a month. I know what he'll do with it. I know he'll travel more with it. I know he can hang out with his family more. In fact he's going to come over here to Seattle to see me. I know that's what he can do with that but I never asked him directly why he wanted that $200,000 a month. That's a good question. I'm writing it down.
Sam Ovens: Then you also, you help course sellers who already have customers to scale.
Jesse Navarro: Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Sam Ovens: To get more customers.
Jesse Navarro: Yep.
Sam Ovens: That's it.
Right now that's it. That's probably why I'm only making $250,000 a year and not 2.5 million a year. Because I haven't quite figured that piece out. In fact, that's been, over the past maybe 9 to 12 month I kind of figured that piece out and it took me a little bit. Remember I started this thing probably at the end of 2014, beginning of 2015 and I still haven't quite put all the pieces together. I don't know, honestly I can't figure out how I made money, just out of sheer will I guess. That's been, I kind of fell on this by accident too. Like I said, my friend just needed help with a course and so I just built it and it worked. Then I did it again and it worked. I guess I can use some help to find out-
[00:16:30] What do you think, there's always this [inaudible 00:16:28] that plays out with these things. It's like people choose their niche based on having affinity to that thing. You're probably in a lot of courses.
Jesse Navarro: Yeah.
Sam Ovens: You probably have attachment to courses, you like them. You probably like course sellers. That niche kind of makes sense.
Jesse Navarro: Yep.
[00:17:00] You like it, you know it, you understand it, you're passionate about it. Then you know people who are already in it so you kind of choose that, you start talking to them, you find this problem they have and then you think you can help them solve that problem.
Jesse Navarro: Right.
Sam Ovens: What gave you the belief that you thought you could solve that problem for them?
[00:18:00] I think what gave me the confidence anyway was working with the first course, the SEO course with Joshua [Erp 00:17:16] and how successful it was. I think that gave me the confidence to kind of put myself out there that I could actually do it. Then I just, again, I asked other entrepreneurs if they need it like Sean Bossler and kind of things got a little bit bigger. It gave me a little more confidence. I think that's how it developed. All these guys, they're cool guys to hang out with too. I think that's kind of the fun part is when I'm talking with them, it's just kind of like talking with friends. The whole thing is just fun. Some of it, I've done some of the stuff I haven't got paid for, which I mean I'm kind of okay with because the whole process is just kind of fun for me. Don't get me wrong, I love the money. I've got a 19 month old, I've got to feed my family but for the most part, this whole process is just fun for me. I really enjoy it. Anyway, I think that's kind of, hopefully I answered your question.
[00:18:30] What made you think you knew how to solve the problem for them? It's fun, I get that, which is good. That's really good but how did you know that you'd be able to do things that they didn't know how to do or bring things to their attention they weren't aware of?
[00:20:00] That's a good question. Josh for example, he doesn't know how to put anything together in click funnels, I mean he's an SEO guy. His main focus is SEO and he just wants to focus on SEO, he wants to build up clients with SEO and in the course, he doesn't really want to know how to put things together in active campaign or write a sales letter. He doesn't even have the time to do it. Sean Bossler is another one. Sean probably knows 10 times more than I know but he's one guy. He doesn't have the time to put together a seven day email campaign or throw things together in active campaign. He doesn't have the time to do all that. I think the biggest thing, the selling point I always have is just, is one like with Josh, he doesn't have the time or the expertise to do it. I'll do it. I'll put it together for you. Sean is more the time. He doesn't have the time to do a lot of the stuff. It's like, all right let me do it for you, save you all this time and you can review it and make up dates later if you want to do that. I think to answer your question, a lot of it is time is number one and two is the expertise part of it. They just don't want to do it.
I've got another guy I'm working with, he's a copywriter. The same exact thing. He doesn't know the automation process, click funnels and email campaigns and putting this all together. I stepped in and I helped him put it together.
Sam Ovens: Got it. A lot of the value comes from the done for you element.
Jesse Navarro: The done for you element, yes.
[00:20:30] You're really helping them by doing the work, doing it for them. It sounds like it's more so that right now than bringing things into their awareness that they weren't aware of.
[00:21:00] Sometimes it's like that. For example, bringing in things that they weren't aware of. I mean that happens all the time too. For example, one of the guys I'm working with, Dave, he has a phone flipping course. There is dozens of things that we're putting together that he wasn't aware of. Example, creating a brand new hook and angle of how to sell this thing or his funnel was kind of not put together correctly. I just adjusted it a little bit, we're increasing conversions. It's both parts. It's parts that they're not either aware of or they don't have the time for but a lot of it, you're right, is done for you. It really is both parts and it has to be both parts or else the whole thing won't work.
Got it. You really help experts in a specific field get their expertise sold online.
Jesse Navarro: Yeah.
Sam Ovens: They could be an expert but they don't know how to do the funnels, they don't know how to do the ads, market information because that doesn't, being an expert in SEO doesn't entail being an expert in all of those other things, you know what I mean?
Jesse Navarro: Right. Yep.
It's possible for someone to be an expert in all of these things but not know anything about these other things.
Jesse Navarro: Yes. You're absolutely right.
Sam Ovens: It's just like dentists learn that being a doctor, knowing dentistry and having all the equipment and a lease and sitting in there still doesn't mean that customers come.
Jesse Navarro: Yes.
[00:22:30] You also have to know how to get the customers which is a shock to a lot of them because they've gone through so much, they're in a lot of debt, they've done all of this and now they learn that there's this other science that they have to learn.
Jesse Navarro: Yep. That's exactly it. Yes. I couldn't say that better myself. That's it.
Sam Ovens: It really is another whole science, thinking about it.
Yeah, science and what are your thoughts on creativity too? Especially with your course, you have a really nice angle when you're selling your, still when you're selling your consulting course, very different than how other people are doing it. There's other people that try to do the consulting thing but you did it the best because you had a really awesome angle and a really awesome story behind it. I don't know. How much do you think is really creativity versus science? Is it 50/50 or it is, is there a percentage to that? What are your thoughts?
I think it's science because what you said is I had a unique angle and a good story and all of this. Having a good story and good results and credibility are components that come together to form a strong ad.
Jesse Navarro: Okay.
Sam Ovens: If we break down what makes a good ad, its good components.
Jesse Navarro: Yeah, science.
[00:24:00] What makes a good meal? Good ingredients. You know what I mean? It's not so much the mixing of the ingredients, it's more the quality of them.
Jesse Navarro: Okay.
Sam Ovens: You can't write a great angle or a great ad with shitty ingredients. What if you don't have any case studies, what if you don't have a story, what if you don't have any results? What the hell are you going to say?
[00:24:30] That's a good point. I didn't think of it that way. Really you can break it down, it's all about science. Yeah. That's a good point.
[00:25:00] Then it gets creative when you can say things no one else can say because you've done things no one else has done but a lot of it comes back to, a lot of it comes back to create good ads, to create good funnels you have to have a great business. What you say in these things are just frameworks for information. An ad is a framework for putting in pieces of information. So is a webinar. It's got slides in it. Those slides have texts and images in it. Those texts and images like encapsulate things that happened. You know what I mean? It's just a framework and to put the things into the framework you have to have good things. Without those good things you can't really create a good ad or a good webinar because it doesn't matter what framework you've got, you're just going to be putting junk into it.
Right. Kind of what you said then, if that's true, the base is always scientific but it's almost like, when you mentioned food it's like, the scientific part is the ingredients, the high quality ingredients but it's like how you put the ingredients together is where the creativity comes in. It's like, what did I hear [inaudible 00:25:56] something about that, kind of what you, I think you said that earlier. You basically said if you have a really awesome ingredients, it's exactly what you said. If you have really awesome ingredients but if you're a really horrible chef, it doesn't matter how good the ingredients are, the food is going to be crap. I would almost imagine that the chef is almost like the scientist and the creative at the same time because he has really awesome ingredients and he knows how to put it together. That's going to be the best food you'll ever taste.
Yeah but you've got to have both things, right? That thing that's hardest to do is have the good ingredients.
[00:27:00] Yeah, you're 100%. That's coming up with an amazing product. I think that's been most successful with what I do is the clients that I work with are not just well known but they're really, really good at what they do. They just focus on this. Josh, he just focuses on SEO. Dave, with his phone flipping course. He has stores, physical location stores where all he does is just flips electronics all day long. They get really, really good at that one thing and then I come in and I say, "Hey look. We could, there's a whole nother revenue source out there that you may not be thinking of. Let's build that. You keep doing what you're doing, I just need content from you and I'll take this and run with it." That's where I've been really successful. A lot of it has been done for you. Just thinking through, that's where I found most of my success.
There's a germ of success present already. That's the most important thing. You know? You're just helping it evolve. When that germ isn't there it isn't even possible.
[00:28:30] That's what all the failure I've had, I wouldn't say failure but that's where the struggles I had with the financial, when I was working with financial advisors. They just didn't, a lot of them weren't that great of a financial advisor or they were just brand new in the business. It went nowhere and it was really hard to get them to make any money. Their mind wasn't correct. They did one offer and they freaked out if it didn't work. I'm like, these are horrible clients. This is not going to work. Then I work with guys who are just masters of their craft and it works. It's magic. It's insane. It's not magic, it's science. I'm talking with Sam, it's science but it's a complete, it's night and day. It really is. That's why I just continued working with this. It's my fault for not defining it but I think I've just been so focused on this thing I just kept pushing and I didn't think to define what I actually did.
Sam Ovens: Got it. How do you package and price this to people? How do you make an offer to someone?
I use your sales script by the way. Obviously there's a couple pieces I missed in the sales script. The beginning piece I use. I probably should use all the sales script but how I price anyway is like, with Josh, I just went 50/50 with him. 50% of the sales go to me. I didn't put any money down, he didn't put any money down, we just did the work together. Some of them I'll charge an upfront cost if it's going to take me a little bit of my time or if I need to hire a graphic designer to do some work. Then a percentage of the profits. That's how I usually price it. One guy, the copywriting guy, I just did, I didn't have anything up front, I just did a percentage of sales. I know it's not going to cost me a lot on the front end to build it. It just depends and if it's going to cost me some money on the front end I'll charge some money on the front end then I'll have a percentage of profits on any sales.
Sam Ovens: Got it. Then how did you go about getting your first client?
[00:31:00] In this space it just was by pure accident. My buddy Joshua [Erp 00:30:14] was talking to me about building the course and I said let's just do it. He's technically my first client. My friend was my first client. It just was, it's weird but I know it really doesn't help your audience but kind of before that I think the big thing, if people are listening, this audience, I kind of put myself in that scenario to meet people like Joshua [Erp 00:30:36]. I paid Ty $25,000 to be part of his Mastermind in 2015 and because of that I was around everybody. Everybody who knows Ty. You kind of get a huge network at that time. There's something weird if you have a big network but then you also have a skill that they want, it's an incredible thing. It's easy to make sales at that point. That's kind of how I met them was through a Mastermind with Ty. My advice would be if you can, spend money to get in a network if you have a skill.
Sam Ovens: Got it. Then how are you getting new clients now?
[00:32:00] Still within my network, like Dave. I just reached out to Dave, I found his funnel. I just put together, what I do is I put together a proposal. I went through his entire funnel, some of his emails say, "Hey look here's some things we could change." Sometimes I'll build out an entire map of what the funnel could look like. I'll say, "Hey look, here's a couple things that's going wrong with your funnel. Here's what we can change, here's what we can fix, oh by the way I can do this for you too if you want. Let's jump on a call." Sure enough, jump on a call and say, "Let's do it." That's how I get new clients, at least right now. This whole cool process is I don't need a whole lot of clients because right now I have four that I'm on, I have a percentage of sales with. Two of them were, we just started. Right now, I'm making money with just two clients right now.
Sam Ovens: How is that pricing model going to work when you run ads?
That's a good question. How that pricing model works, it depends on the ad spend. If the ad spend gets expensive we just turn it to kind of a profit share. If they're spending a ton of money on ads- [crosstalk 00:32:39]
Sam Ovens: Who fronts the ad spend?
Jesse Navarro: They front the ad spend.
Sam Ovens: Got it. That's the only way it can work, you have to do it on the profit after ad spend.
[00:33:00] Yeah. We haven't got to a point where we're making, we're any ways from hundreds of thousands of dollars a month but I would imagine there will be a problem at some point in time down the line so we'll have to renegotiate the contract. It's just a problem I can see down the road. So far we haven't run into that issue, which I hope to run into that issue at some point but it will happen.
Sam Ovens: Got it. Then, we can talk about the Facebook ads thing, I'm just interested to hear how you couldn't scale. How come you couldn't?
Well, for some crazy reason, 100% it's probably human error, I can almost guarantee its human error. I'm pulling up the ads right now. The, where is it at? The method that I used was not on the campaign level but on the ad level basically I just added another ad there. That's how I used the scale. I put another 20 bucks a day in under their ad and I kept building that out. At some point it didn't work the same as the original ad. There was some human error to it too because I was working with a buddy of mine and he would go in and mess around with it. I think that also messed it up too. Here you go. I have this here. That's, let me pull this up. I should have been prepared for this, that's my fault for not having this up and ready to go. Here we go, December 2016 stats. Let's take a look here. Is this the one, this happened in December 2016. This is only one month we're able to do this and we couldn't, we weren't able to replicate it, even if I just turned on the ads and let it run. It wouldn't work. Here we go. This started in November 2016. 20 bucks in ad spend, we made, we got 10 leads and 4 sales. Our cost per sale was $4.95.
Sam Ovens: On what? What priced thing?
[00:36:00] The price on that one, this was, we were running a $500 course. We had three $500 courses, total sales, $19.81 we made 1500 bucks, out of 20 bucks. Then the next day, $20.40 we made $643. Next day $24, we made $44, the next day we spent $29.11, we got 85 leads and we made $3875 out of 30 bucks, which was insane.
Sam Ovens: What was the problem? What went wrong?
Then we increased our ad by I think a lot. The next day we spent $188 and our total sales for that day was 517 bucks. We spent $100 the next day and I think we may have shut a campaign off, we made $745. Then I think we shut off all the campaigns because now we only spent $25 the next day and we made $541. $95 a day after that, we made $124. 25 bucks the next day and we only made $28. It kind of went downhill from there. There are some days we didn't make any money. It was crazy. One day it went really high and then it kind of-
Sam Ovens: How did you only make $28 when the product is 500?
The way we had our funnel set up is we have a $7 offer up front. We had, how many $7 offers we had, we had 7 sales, I don't think that number is correct, it says we had 7 sales. I don't think that number is 100% correct. [crosstalk 00:37:43]
Sam Ovens: Then you guys basically just freaked out and turned it off.
[00:38:00] That's basically what happened is we freaked out and turned it off. We tried to turn it back on again and it just didn't perform the same way it did before. That was out experience with Facebook ads. Basically all of our sales that we're getting right now is almost organic. I would love to do paid traffic but I don't think I have the paid traffic skill. I need to- [crosstalk 00:38:16]
Sam Ovens: No, you just don't have the nerves. You have to hang on, even when it's losing.
[00:38:30] Yeah, that's probably it too. I didn't have the nerve, especially in 2016, December 2016 I 100% didn't have the nerve in December 2016. I was the most scared person you probably could meet.
[00:39:00] I'm happy to swing 100 grand backwards in my ads because I know over time it corrects itself. A huge amount of it is just calmness and not freaking out. You just keep it going and then you iterate it, you iterate it and you make it better but you can't ever freak out otherwise you're screwed. That's not how you run an experiment.
Jesse Navarro: That's what I said, if I were to go back, I would probably hire someone to work on these ads so that way I just have someone there doing it. I don't even pay attention to it.
[00:40:00] It sounds more like it's the person whose money it is that's the one whose freaking out. That's why you need to have a set aside amount of money where you're like, "This is what we spend." There's no freaking out. You know what I mean? This is what most mistakes people make is they'll spend a bit, they'll spend a bit and then they'll be like, "Pause it, pause it" because they manage their money like shit. They start freaking out the moment they don't get a couple of sales or something because they run on such thin, first of all they don't know their numbers. Second of all, they don't have any nerves. They have too many of them really. They need to blunten them so that they're not so reactive. They don't have enough money sitting there like a war chest, you know what I mean?
Jesse Navarro: Right.
[00:40:30] Sometimes a war chest, you have to dig into it to go to war and then when you win, you put the winnings back in. But there's no such thing as never dipping into it.
[00:41:00] That's a good point because I talk about all the time in my financial practice is when people who manage their own money, they can't do it because it's their own money. That's where the benefit of hiring someone to do it is you just, it's easier to manage something when it's not your own money. You have less emotions around it. I think with this one, December 2016, we started the business in October so we probably only had 10 grand in that account at that time. The business has only been around for just a few months. We probably only had 10 grand in that account and I own half the business. I probably was freaking out because I only had 10 grand and it's all going to go away on these ads. That's probably what happened at that time.
[00:41:30] Yeah, it's mostly I see it when people behave like that, it's not that you're bad at Facebook ads, it's not the ads, it's just the freaking out part, which most of the time is derived from not having enough of a war chest.
Jesse Navarro: Right.
Sam Ovens: Or not being comfortable dipping into that whole thing.
Jesse Navarro: That's exactly what it was.
Sam Ovens: I like playing with my own money. It makes me better because it hurts when I lose.
Jesse Navarro: I need to build some stronger nerves. There's lots of things I need to do, that's probably one of them.
We screwed things up one month this year in February, lost half a million dollars in cash.
Jesse Navarro: Wow.
Sam Ovens: Yeah.
Jesse Navarro: If a half a million dollars went out of my-
Sam Ovens: In a month.
Jesse Navarro: Out of my retirement accounts, I'd probably freak out.
[00:42:30] Yeah but that's, I kind of like it in a way because it teaches you a lesson. We learned don't screw with this thing. That's basically what we learned. We were able to make it back easily in a week on future months but you have to have that calmness. It's like buying into a stock. You're sure this is a great stock, you've done the value analysis on it, it is solid. Now the market's opinion might change and it might go down but that doesn't mean that you sell the damn thing. It really means you should buy more of it.
Jesse Navarro: Mm-hmm (affirmative).
Sam Ovens: You know?
Right. It goes down, the value goes up.
Sam Ovens: Well, no if it goes down then nothing changes in your value analysis. It's just a market opinion unless the company was found to be fraudulent and the things that you've done, your value analysis, were not true. Okay, that changes things. But I'm saying because the market's opinion changes but the underlying value of a company stays constant or improves but it's just the opinion that swings.
[00:44:00] What happens with ads is that if you know your funnel and you know the traffic and you know the market and you know how everything works, it's just ebbs and flows in the conversion rate, regression to the mean. You've just got to hold out and then it kicks back. It's all about averages over time. It's not about days. You can easily lose money in a day, it's even possible to lose money in a week. You shouldn't really, things should be evening out in a week but really you're not going to see anything even out until you're at 30 days. You have to just let it kind of ebb and flow and wait for those averages to settle.
Jesse Navarro: Right. That's a really good analogy, in fact it's funny because I talk about that almost every single day but I, for some reason relate it to Facebook ads and they're the exact same thing.
Sam Ovens: They're different in a way but they're the same in a way.
Right. Exactly right. If you look at your stock portfolio every single day it dips. Like I said, it dips, it just means if it's a good stock it just means the intrinsic value went up. You're right. You should buy more instead of freaking out and selling.
Sam Ovens: What's the future look like for you? Where do you want to take this business, one year, two years, five years from now?
That's a good question. I mean, I also haven't really thought through that as well. I mean, if I can pick up, if I can get four or five clients that are paying $23,000 a month I think I would just be happy but I also know that's not, there has to be a change, something needs to happen. I don't know, maybe if I get good enough I'll create my own course at some point but that's probably the evolution is where I'll be forced to do, to create something of my own and it probably would just out of force because I absolutely have to. That's probably the evolution of it next.
Sam Ovens: Why do you think you'll be forced to have to do that?
I mean because I really don't know the value or how long for example if I have you know, clients that are paying me $10, $20, $30,000 a month that's because we're doing $100,000 a month. A lot of it depends on their business too. If they want to continue doing it. They can just stop being in business tomorrow if they really wanted to and my business goes away. The reason why is because it's less, it's more dependent on them. I'd much rather have a business where it's dependent on my actions as opposed to someone else's. Kind of like consulting. This is your business, you can choose to move forward, you could choose to move backwards, you can choose whatever you want to do with it and in a way you have a ton more freedom than I do because of that. I don't have that luxury, that freedom. If they want to make an update or change their business, I have to pitch that to them and sell it to them whereas you, if you want to make an update or change your business, you just do it. That's really cool but it comes with its own responsibilities with it as well. I'll have to consider that.
Got it. Then what would you say is being the one most transformative part of going through the Consulting Accelerator program?
[00:48:00] Affirmations, 100% man. You have this crazy, especially the newer program, the 2.0 that you put together. Man those affirmations are just crazy. The way you put that training together to do these, it's a very specific way. It is night and day. It changes your life. Here's the reason why, because when you wake up in the morning you know exactly what you need to do because I've got my planner. Your days are more clear plus the affirmations kind of reset the brain a little bit too. It completely changes you as a person.
Sam Ovens: Cool.
Jesse Navarro: That's what I got for that.
Sam Ovens: What would your number one piece of advice be for other members in the Consulting Accelerator community?
The number one advice, it's so cliché, do not give up. That's probably the most cliché thing I could probably say but I mean, I went through probably two or three different niches before finding something that worked for me. That was, those are hard because I went through the entire process, I went through your course probably five or six times. The worksheets, I still have them. I've got dozens of these worksheets that I filled out that I'm never going to use again. But it's weird because that whole entire process actually taught me how to do what I do now. It was almost a learning, just kind of a learning opportunity, more of an education. Don't give up because you don't know what's going to happen next.
Sam Ovens: That's good advice. Cool man, thanks for jumping on and sharing your story. Where can people learn more about you?
I don't even have a website. I probably should but I don't. Shoot me an email, [email protected]
I don't care if I get floods of email. Chances are, you know what's funny, I always talk to entrepreneurs, they don't want to put their information out there because they might get too much emails. I'm like, it's usually the opposite. Usually no one ever contacts them. [email protected]
if you want to shoot me an email if you have questions about- [crosstalk 00:49:51] what's that?
Sam Ovens: You wait, that will change.
Jesse Navarro: Yeah.
[00:50:00] You'll have to find every place in every video you ever said your email or it was present at the top right and fix it because if you leave any clue then yeah.
Jesse Navarro: Oh really?
Sam Ovens: Later on, when lots of people are trying to get your attention. At the start it's different but later on it actually becomes an issue.
[00:50:30] You're absolutely right. If I'm a Sam Ovens then yeah, I could imagine there would be a ton of people vying for your attention right now but yeah. Anyway, this is one piece of content that I will look at back in the future and see if I can change when I get back to it. Anyway right now that's the best way to contact me. If you do want to see that email content, I can send that over to you Sam.
Sam Ovens: Cool. Awesome man. Thanks for jumping on and sharing your story.
Jesse Navarro: Yeah thank you so much. Appreciate it.
Sam Ovens: See you.
Jesse Navarro: Bye.